Monday, January 19, 2009

IM conversation with co-worker (and Cub fan) Donald

Don has been down on his team since the end of Game 3 against the Dodgers (actually it's probably closer to the end of Game 1). On Sunday, his team traded the once-untouchable (and 5 tool?) prospect Felix Pie to the Orioles for a couple of young pitchers Garrett Olsen, 25 and Henry Williamson, 23. Here is the IM conversation Don and I just had.

Donald(08:31): Was Garrett Olsen like the O's 5th starter last year?
Brian(08:32): Kinda. He's one of those guys who has been good in the minors and then sucks royally when he's reached the majors. Much like Felix Pie actually.
Donald(08:32): ahhh the old crap for crap
Brian(08:32): Or....the old "you take my crap and turn it gold while I take your crap and keep it crap"
Donald(08:33): Or....the old "you take my crap and turn it gold while I take your crap and give it to San Diego to make it gold while taking their crap"
Brian(08:33): i just LOL'd

Cubs Fever! See if you can catch it!

Also, this team won 97 games last year.

Awesome. Go White Sox!

FOLLOW-UP FROM BRIAN: Where was Kenny Williams while this trade was happening? You're telling me the White Sox couldn't find a spot on their roster for a guy like Felix Pie when their current CF's are Brian Anderson and friggin' Jerry Owens? Shameful.

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  1. Michael Says:

    And the difference between Jerry Owens and Felix Pie is...?

    I'll hang up and wait for my answer.

  2. Anonymous Says:

    I will answer that if you're serious.

    Jerry Owens' career numbers in the minors = .291/.359/.359 in nearly 2000 at bats. That's a good OBP, but an embarrassing SLG. In 381 at bats in the majors, his offensive numbers are embarrassingly bad. Granted this is a small sample size, but he'll be 28 in 2009, so basically, what you see is what you're gonna get.

    Felix Pie's career numbers in the minors = .299/.353/.470 in over 2500 AB's. Yeah, .470!!!! His major league numbers are just as embarrassing as Jerry Owens, but it's an even smaller sample than Jerry's and Pie is 4 full years younger.

    So my point stands. The Orioles gave up an A-ball pitcher and a long-reliever for a 23 year old former top prospect who can hit for power, gets on base, and has a great arm in the outfield (Jerry's arm is weaker than Lance Johnson's).

  3. Michael Says:

    Felix Pie's numbers against LHPs:

    .106/.192/.106, 0 HR, 6 RBI, 5 BB, 13 SO (0 HR, 75 RBI, 62 BB, 162 SO per 650 PA)

    Jerry Owens's numbers agaisnt LHPs:
    .236/.313/.278, 0 HR, 4 RBI, 7 BB, 16 SO (0 HR, 32 RBI, 56 BB, 130 SO per 650 PA)

    Be aware that Owens has had 80 PA against LHPs, while Pie has had 52 PA.

    I'm not saying that Owens is any great shakes, but why do you want to spend anything for a guy that, at best, is a marginal upgrade from Jerry Owens, and is more accurately a regression because of his abject inability to hit anything tailing away from him? If he hasn't learned how to hit left handed pitching by now, he's not going to pick it up anytime soon.

    (Stats courtesy of

  4. Anonymous Says:

    You're cherry-picking a small sample. Using any of Felix's major league numbers is unfair because he just hasn't played enough at that level. Also, I showed you that he's not a marginal upgrade. We're talking over 100 points of slugging and a better defender. The key though is Pie's age. He was 23, Jerry was 27.

    And lastly, I wouldn't spend anything. I'd have given the Cubs exactly what the Orioles gave them, which is a long-reliever and an A-ball starter.

  5. Michael Says:

    You can't compare minor league statistics to major league production. I may be cherry-picking but unfortunately the major league statistics show a trend that is not encouraging. As far as major league statistics go, Pie is not more than a marginal upgrade.

    We may have to agree to disagree on this one. I'll take Brian Anderson as a fielder - he's better than both Pie and Owens. As for hitting...well, we'll see on that one.

  6. Anonymous Says:

    Okay, a couple of things. One, at this point we can only use minor league production because Felix Pie doesn't have any major league production. You can argue whether or not that's his fault I suppose.

    Two, my main point wasn't to say that Felix Pie is better (although I think I've proven that he is). My main point was that the White Sox have a serious weakness in CF. Felix Pie doesn't represent a guaranteed solution to that weakness. But he does represent a 3rd option. And I don't think you'd disagree with me that our current 2 options both sucketh the biggeth.

  7. Michael Says:

    I will agree with you there. We need a better option than Owens or Brian Anderson (he of the lifetime .221/.277/.379). I just don't think Pie is it. (Obviously he's not now, since he's with the Orioles, where good rookies go to die.)

    One has to wonder what Kenny is planning at this point...